Beasts of Rage - 2500 points, Adding a little variety to my army

I would think this is a good argument for taking a larger bus. Doesn't matter what else you put out there, the minos are going to be taking the brunt of the firepower, so I think extra bodies is best way to make the unit more robust.

Also yes, I don't see a better way to spend core points here. 4 units of raiders is a good number - 2 for ambushing when up against gunlines!

The Minotaurs bulking up the back also provide a crucial aspect in ranks. My plan is to use Chariots as the complementary unit to them, so this army would otherwise struggle to break Steadfast. Not so when the Minotaurs run 4 deep. It also gives me the option of running it as a 4 x 3 with the Champ in front, which is definitely something I'll consider when fighting a unit that can't get through T4, 4+ armor easily (or that has Flaming Attacks).

I'd say drop the shields for xtra hw once they hit frenzy they lose the pary save. As the bsb can be protected in the second rank why not give him the beast banner? S6 Minos Mmmm

I choose shields to protect the Minotaurs from small-arms fire as much as I can. A 5+ armor save means that I at least get some sort of save against Skink Blowpipes and other pesky shots, and it means the Bloodkine has a respectable 4+ save. I would also love to have The Beast Banner, but that goes against the idea of the Minobus in the first place. Its goal is to use the Minotaurs as a delivery system for the characters, not the other way around. I want my big boys up front.

I see where you are going. I'd feel uneasy with a list like this But I' sure you are good enough to pull it off.

It's definitely a bit of a balancing act - that's why all that chaff is there to attract attention from shooters and war machines. If you don't pay attention to them, they will take those ranged tools out of the picture. They also help protect my Minobus. I do wish I could squeeze the Chalice of Dark Rain in here, though.

I see what you mean about the extra bulls now. Its about giving the characters a look out sir but also keeping enough ranks to threaten steadfast. Fair enough.

While I wouldn't suggest you prune the unit as hard as bossman is suggesting, I think what he mentions about getting another threat on the board is a useful suggestion however.

If you take a few minotaurs out of the unit it may give you enough points to put something like a razorgor chariot or a small herd of razorgor (three in 2 ranks for example) in there as well. This does two things. It gives you an extra heavy hitting unit that reduces the one trick pony feel from the list. It'll also help your gor herd out with some much needed punch should they need to take on an enemy unit away from the bus. What it also does though is divide the attention of any shooting attacks.

A load of minos in a unit and not much else in the way of heavy hitters means that your mino unit will get targetted no questions asked. Taking a few minos out to be able to afford a razorgor chariot or a herd of razorgor (second option being more survivable obviously) means that the stuff your opponent is shooting at you needs to be divided between the two units if they're going to take out both.

Finally if a minobus has lots of ranks then that maximises the return that cannons will get when pointed at the bus. With four ranks they're killing four a turn potentially. Thats an awful lot of dead cow! Also when you think about it, putting the bus into a steadfast unit and having it stick there for a couple of combat turns is not necessarily a bad thing. They'll be winning combat and cos they'll be winning combat they'll be getting more and more attacks each. Not necessarily a bad thing to be honest (when taken in moderation obviously).

The thing is, a Razorgor Chariot doesn't hit much harder than a Tuskgor one (the only difference is 2 S4 attacks vs. 4 S5 attacks - everything else is identical) - the difference is that it's a lot sturdier (though almost twice as costly and not a Core choice). It's still only got Ld7 and is just a Chariot, though, so it's not like it's going to be able to tackle enemy units on its own. A Herd of Razorgor is a bit more intriguing, but their Leadership being as arse as it is bodes ill for their chances of sticking around in a given fight, especially given that they have little insurance from a fluffed attack roll. The Minobus kind of is a one-trick-pony build - I don't really see much of a way to mitigate that. Lowering the Minotaur count only exposes my characters to more danger, so I think I just have to live with it.

I do disagree with there only being one real target, though - if artillery does not shoot the chaff that's racing upfield, I am going to wipe out his machines by the end of my second turn (at least, that's the plan). It's also worth noting that I have a caster with Lore of Shadows and a big Herd of Gors - there's a lot of incentive for me to fling a bunch of dice at Mindrazor every phase, and that does turn the Gors into a threat.

I'm inclined to agree. 6 should be fine

Fair play about the chariots - they really shine when a character is put on one but I suppose there's not a great deal of difference between a lone one and a lone tuskgor.

The razorgor herd has poor leadership by itself yes but as there are only two ranked units in this army it shouldn't be that difficult to keep it within 12" of your doom bull. Particularly if you deploy three in two ranks. One other option would be a unit of centigor. They'd help with the warmachine hunting and can hit harder and are more resistant to warmachine damage than the lone razorgors.

Fair point about the chaff vs warmachines and level four shadow and gor horde synergy though, I'll give you that.

The more I think about it, the more you need that chalice though. At the moment if a cannon hits that unit of minotaurs its potentially killing four minotaur at the first hit. Then three more with the second hit (if it gets a second round of shooting, or two cannons shooting in the first turn). Thats seven dead cows in two turns of shooting. That pays for a lot of chalices. Drop a cow and pick up a chalice say I.

Fair enough, gents. A Chalice caddy with Lore of Beasts for 3 Minotaurs it is.

This post has been edited by rothgar13 on Apr 30 2012, 02:26 PM