Legends, Info on Brazilian football legends

In Memoriam – Valdemar dos Santos Figueira

Early Sunday night (22/8), one of the greatest players to ever wear Palmeiras’ jersey left us. Valdemar dos Santos Figueira, known as Valdemar Carabina, died in a hospital in Salvador, Bahia. Carabina, who during his five last years fought Alzheimer’s disease, was born in São Paulo on the 28 January 1932. He reached the age of 78.

Carabina played his first game for Palmeiras on the 16 May 1954 and stayed in the club for a total of twelve years. As a defender, he incorporated the marvellous team of 1965 – baptised “The Academy” – which in a memorable moment, on the 7 September that same year, represented Brazil in a friendly against Uruguay and won 3-0.

With Palmeiras, Carabina was three times São Paulo Champion (1959, 1963 and 1966), in addition to a Taça Brasil (1960) and a Rio-São Paulo tournament (1965). He played a total of 584 games in Palmeiras’ colours; 333 wins, 116 draws and 135 losses. For the Brazilian National Team, he played 2 official games. During a period in 1987, after having retired as a player, Carabina also acted as coach of Palmeiras.

Valdemar only scored nine goals for Palmeiras, but it was exactly one of those – a spectacular and extremely hard shot – that earned him his nickname. At the time, famous radio commentator Mário Moraes commented that the shot was superior to that of a rifle (carabina).

Condolences to Valdemar’s family and friends. You will be missed by palmeirenses and football lovers alike.

For a few pictures of Valdemar Carabina, have a look at http://tinyurl.com/35mpc8r

I think I read where Valdemar Carabina was 5th all time on Palmeiras' appearance list. But he only made 2 appearances for Brasil, one of them what was mentioned above when Palmeiras represented Brasil vs Uruguay in 1965.

RIP

Anybody else amused that Romario of all people won election to the lower house of Brazil's National Assembly?

Bebeto also won a statewide assembly office in Rio de Janeiro.

Yes Romario has won a federal legislative seat. Pretty amazing if you ask me.

But he and Bebeto were not the only footballers winning legislative positions. Former Atletico Mineiro forward Marques won a spot in the Minais Gerias legislature while ex Gremio goalie Danrlei won a seat in the Rio Grande do Sul legislature. Danrlei was Gremio's goalie when the Felipao coached team were Copa Libertadores champions in 1995.

Former Brasil international forward and current Vasco president Roberto Dinamite won re election to Rio de Janeiro's state legislature. Former Vasco president/crook Eurico Miranda did not.

The current Goias goalie Harlei failed in his bid to win a seat in Goainia. Also failing to win election were Tulio, an ex Botafogo and Brasil forward and a pair of ex Corinthian players Vampeta and Marcelinho Carioca.

it did not help his club is currently near the bottom of the Brasileirao. Not wise to run for political office when your team is not doing well!

Bebeto I can see going into politics, but Romario never struck me as being the sort who would enter that field. But he already tried and failed in club management, so he decided to seek another field.

As for Tulio, who did not win a seat, our Argentinian posters likely remember him from the 1995 Copa America, check out 0:53 into this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DMOWpyMd908

With Fluminense apparently on the verge of winning the league championship, I found an article on a championship they won in 1970, the Taca de Prata (Silver Cup), which was a precursor to the first Brasileirao which was created the following year.

http://globoesporte.globo.com/platb/memoriaec/

The Taca de Prata had 17 competing teams from the 7 biggest states in the nation, Rio, São Paulo, Minas, Rio Grande do Sul, Paraná, Pernambuco & Bahia. 1970 of course was the year Brazil won their third World Cup title in Mexico with a memorable team of players, all of whom played in Brazil so the Taca de Prata was full of big name stars. The tournament was played in 2 groups with the top two in each group advancing to a final 4 team group which consisted of Fluminense, Palmeiras, Cruzeiro & Atletico Mineiro. On the final day of play Fluminense drew with Atletico Mineiro 1-1 which enabled them to win the Taca de Prata edging out Palmeiras. Click on the link I provided above which has an embedded video of that Fluminense title winning team.

Fluminense only had 1 World Cup winner on it's team, goalkeeper Felix but midfielder Denilson and striker Mickey, a scorer of key goals in the finals, also were stars on that team. This was Fluminense's team on the day they clinched that championship:

Félix, Oliveira, Galhardo, Assis e Marco Antonio(Toninho); Denilson e Didi; Cafuringa, Mickey, Cláudio e Lula

The Didi on that team was not the Didi who was the star mifielder on Brazil's 1958 & 1962 World Cup winning teams. The Taca de Prata of course is not officially considered an official national title but Fluminense did win a Brasileirao in 1984, as we discuss a bit in the current Brasileirao discussion thread, with a team coached by Carlos Alberto Parreira and led by Paragauayan playmaker Julio Cesar Romero and Brazilian 1994 World Cup winner Branco. This was the typical starting team Fluminense used in their 1984 title winning season:

Paulo Víctor, Aldo, Duílio, Ricardo Gomes e Branco; Jandir, Delei e Assis; Romerito, Washington e Tato

So tomorrow will we be able to add another Fluminense title winning team to this list?

Excellent information, the Taca de Prata was the precursor to the Brasilian national championship, the Brasileirao and it was a more inclusive tournament than the previous Rio-Sao Paulo Cup between the top clubs from those states. With the Taca de Prata clubs from other states, like Cruzeiro, Atletico Mineiro, Sport, Curitiba, Internacional and Gremio had an opportunity to play the big clubs from Rio and Sao paulo. The Taca de Prata was held for four years, 1967-70 and it's winners were Palmeiras (twice), Santos and in it's final year Fluminense. Officially the winners are not recognized as national champions but unofficially I think we can safely say those were the national champions in those years as it was this competition which eventually convinced the authorities to create the Brasileirao.

Marco Antonio, the 19 year old left back on that 1970 Fluminense team also played in the World Cup and started many games for Brazil but did not play the final vs Italy.

Well Fluminense fans definitely view that 1970 Taca de Prata title as a national title as they were shouting tri-campeao today after winning the 2010 Brasilerao. Interesting that in 1984 and this year they each had forwards named Washington, but obviously not the same player. Ricardo Gomes on that 1984 team was, like Branco, also supposed to be on the 1994 World Cup winning team and in fact was supposed to be the captain but he was injured just before the Cup started and was replaced by Marcio Santos in the selecao's lineup. That is also the same Ricardo Gomes who coached Sao Paulo earlier this year.

Curious that just last week you were discussing this topic and now the CBF has decided it will recognize the Taça Brasil as it was played from 1959-1968 and the Torneio Roberto Gomes Pedrosa (also know as the Taça de Prata or the Robertão) from 1967-70 as official national championships even though both were played before the current national championship, the Brasileirao was created in 1971.

http://globoesporte.globo.com/futebol/noti...iram-octas.html

The winners of those tournaments were:

1959 – Bahia
1960 – Palmeiras
1961 – Santos
1962 – Santos
1963 – Santos
1964 – Santos
1965 – Santos
1966 – Cruzeiro
1967 – Palmeiras
1968 – Botafogo

Torneio Roberto Gomes Pedrosa / Taça de Prata

1967 – Palmeiras
1968 – Santos
1969 – Palmeiras
1970 – Fluminense

I think this is a good idea as those were effectively national championships in their day. The only problem I see is both tournaments were played in 1967 and 1968 so officially there are two national champions now being recognized for those two years. Also notice that in 1967 Palmeiras won both competitions.

In fact under this new recognition of these tournaments, palmeiras and santos with 8 titles each now become the winningest clubs in Brasil, passing Flamengo and Sao Paulo who remain with the 6 each had before adidng these others winners. And Pelé with 6 titles with Santos becomes the player with the most national championships, passing Andrade (all with Flamengo) and Zinho (Flamengo and Palmeiras) who each have 5 national titles.

http://blogdojuca.uol.com.br/2010/12/papai...ex_20101214c-2/

Papai Noel's presents to these clubs, especially Santos and Palmeiras!

From my perspective that is what this was by CBF, a gift to these clubs.

Grin and bear it Alexao! I of course welcome the decision and thsoe competitions were national championships the only difference is they were not officially called that but they did involve clubs from around the nation and determined the best clubs in the country so why not recognize their winners as national champions?

If nothing else I suppose there is some sort of justice that pele now holds the record for a player with most national championships won. Those Santos teams with he, Pepe, Coutinho and Zito were out of this world.

So the new list of title winners after unification of these championships:

8 títulos
Palmeiras e Santos

6 títulos
São Paulo

5 títulos
Flamengo

4 títulos
Vasco e Corinthians

3 títulos
Internacional e Fluminense

2 títulos
Bahia, Botafogo, Grêmio e Cruzeiro

1 título
Atlético-MG, Guarani, Coritiba, Atlético-PR e Sport

Flamengo unfortunately were not declared champion of the Copa União in 1987 when there was a dispute between the major clubs and the CBF and a breakaway competition was held, instead Sport, who won the diluted championship in 1987 will be officially recognized as that season's champions. So while some clubs have increased the number of titles won, notably Palmeiras and Santos, Flamengo's titles won went down from 6 to 5!

Here is the problem I have with including the winners of the Taca Brasil as national champions. The Taca Brasil was not a true championship, it was really a cup tournament, in fact when Santos won those 5 consecutive Taca Brasil titles from 1961-65 they only had to play between 4 -5 games per competition to win it. Check out the records from those competitions here,

http://www.rsssfbrasil.com/tablesae/brcuphst.htm

So to me the Taca Brasil should be considered a forerunner of the current Copa do Brasil but not of the national championship.

The Torneio Roberto Gomes Pedrosa, also known as Taça de Prata, or nicknamed Robertão, was more of a national competition and involved more matches than the Taca Brasil, so I have no problem including it's winners as national champions but including the Taca Brasil winners is a bit much even if by doing so Pele received further honors to his already unrivaled career.

As for the Copa Uniao in 1987, here is a good history of what occurred,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copa_Uni%C3%A3o

Flamengo as champions of the Copa Uniao should have been considered natonal champions that year too but the CBF has turned them down. So Flamengo have 5 national titles, I guess we will have to make it 6 in 2011!

But Alexao, in order to have playe din the Taca Brasil a club ahd to have done well in its state championship, so those acted in a way as an elimination tournament for clubs to enter the Taca Brasil. At the time it was the premier nationwide competition in Brasil, all of the players who have been interviewed these past few weeks since the unification plan was announced then later approved have all said that they considered themselves national champions for winning the Taca Brasil, the difference is now the CBF has officialized that.

As for Flamengo not being declared champions for 1987, the CBF, after resolving the difficulty with the Group of 13 who formed their own tournament in 1987, offered to have Sport and Guarani, the top two clubs in the CBF run tourney play Flamengo and Internacional, the top two clubs in the breakaway league. But Flamengo and Inter turned down the offer and did not play, Sport and Guarani played and just as in the CBF run league Sport won so they were declared national champions for 1987. To me Flamengo only have themselves to blame for not playing off versus Sport and Guarani.