What part of LTS..., affected you the most?

Several other message boards have started discussing their "favorite" parts of LTS.I hesitate to say that these were my "favorite" parts because that makes it sound like I enjoyed them...I didn't...they just about broke my heart.The parts of LTS that meant the most to me were the extremely personal and painful moments...Deb's passing,Ray's abuse and his passing, the "wall-ball" stuff.These things could not have been easy to write about and I feel touched and honored that Clay thinks enough of his fans to trust us with his emotions about these things. :grouphug:

Refresh my memory - what is the "wall-ball" stuff?

Like you said, favourite isn't quite the appropriate word because what stands out for me is all negative. Ray's abuse - The car "stealing" incident sickened me but I'm guessing the wounds from the "can't love someone who isn't your blood" go far deeper. The car ride/freezer cleaning angered me so much - how Faye could get in that car..... Basically how both Ray and Faye did him wrong which came as a complete surprize is what stays with me and I'm guessing everyone else as well.

The part I did enjoy was his going to the prom behind his parents back. Its good to know he had it in him to do that. I kind of wonder if Faye knew he was doing that all along and let him - I'd like to think so - parents are usually wise to these things.

Generally speaking - loved the sarcastic remarks throughout.

When he was in school,the other kids would stand him in front of a wall and repeatedly hit him with a ball..kind of like dodge-ball without the dodge.I was picked on in school too (though not that badly) and that just sickens me.I forgot to mention how funny I thought it was that Brett's nickname for him was "Dodo"..that was my nickname for my maternal grandmother,I really got I kick out of that (and if I ever get the chance to meet him,I'm going to call him that :P )

This post has been edited by Rockys mom on Jan 6 2005, 12:03 AM

I've got to read the book again - I don't recall either of those things.

Here's the kicker, Dodo was what I called my maternal grandfather - honestly - I don't know why I called him that but I did. Given that you think I would have picked up on this in the book - must have been late at night when I read that part. I've never heard anyone else use that "name" until now. Freaky.

The "Dodo" reference is on page 90 in the "Sing from the Heart" chapter.How very strange that you called your grandfather by that same name!My parenta and I always figured I got the "Dodo" from her always telling me to "do" this and don't "do" that...she lived with us and helped raise me.And yeah,this is the first time I'm hearing about anyone else using that nickname,too. BTW-the "wall-ball" reference is on page 64...still can't read it without crying.

This post has been edited by Rockys mom on Jan 6 2005, 08:39 PM

Should retitle this the Rocky's Mom and Clayphoria thread.

Thanks - I'll re-read that section. My grandparents also lived with us. No theories for the dodo though. The don't do's would have been my grandmother as well - of the very strict "children should be seen but not heard" generation.

Hey, guys, can I join??

I need to reread the book and/or listen to the cd again. The parts you mentiioned broke my heart - plus, they made me love my parents even more - wish they were still alive so I could tell them.

The visit to the funeral home when his sister died is also heartwrending for me. The cd sticks out in my mind with Clay describing himself as this tall sobbing kid amid the "adults".

I love this guy and want to tuck him in and tell him it will be okay - okay, out of the "mom" mode - and I don't have kids.

:hello: drycleenonly ,with a beautiful post like that,you better join in !I treated myself to the cd for a Christmas present,but haven't listened to it yet.I'm trying to save it for when the serious Clack withdrawal starts.I know it's an abridged version and I wasn't sure if Debbie's death was on it...it's so painful to read .I hate to think about hearing him say those words.For me.I think the worse was when Faye called to give him the news and he said he screamed for two hours.We all know just how powerful his voice is:to me it's a very heart-rending picture.I guess I'm just being too hard on Faye but I can't see why she called him instead of driving to Charlotte and breaking the news to him in person.I think I read that it's only about an hour drive,he shouldn't have had to deal with that alone,IMHO.And let me know if you need any help with that tucking in stuff cause I love him too :heart:

I definitely plan to re-read the book. I've listened to the audio LTS twice now. My emotions were all over the place when I first read the book in November. First, I was left with very negative feelings about Faye. I really got tired of reading her little pearls of wisdom in this book----Blech! I imagine she has her version of things. I think it would be very hard to justify many of her actions. The abuse by Ray turned my stomach. What kind of grown man delights in torturing a child like that? What an asshole. It must have been hell growing up in that household. The Vernon chapter just left me feeling sad. What a pathetic,lonely man. Alcoholism destroys so many people. I think Vernon was obviously a terrible father. I just could not summon up as much anger towards him as I could towards Ray. I very much related to the chapters where Clay remembers being bullied and picked on at school. "Other kids picked on me like it was their job" describes my eighth and ninth grade years perfectly. Those were painful chapters to read. Judging by the reactions to these chapters that I have read on different Boards, many of us were misfits in school. The Deb chapter tore me apart. How devasting. My heart hurt for him as I read all of this. So very sad. I found the "religion/God" chapter interesting. I think Clay has a long way to go in understanding that people have different beliefs and perspectives on this issue. There is not one right way. He does admit he needs to improve in this area. Life experience sometimes makes people more tolerant. But considering some of the religious fanatics I have encountered on other Boards, some people never learn tolerance-ever. All in all, I loved LTS. I find Clay so intriguing. He's a complex creature.

This post has been edited by Nancy Jeanne on Jan 8 2005, 06:26 PM

Yeah,ninth grade was the worst for me,too.But my Mom and Dad at least tried to help by going to the school and talking to my guidance counselor(didn't work,but that's a whole other story :( )I was thinking while re-reading the book that I don't get why Faye would go to school and sit in class with him all day when he was talking too much ,but wouldn't go to try and stop the abuse,she just told him to let it roll off,or something like that.I,too,was more upset with Ray than with Vernon.Vernon struck me as more ineffectual than abusive,too full,perhaps,of his own inner demons to be able to love anyone else.I couldn't help wondering while watching Clay at the Rockefeller Center Tree lighting that this was the first year he didn't get one of those "stupid,little kid" birthday cards and how he felt about it.Ray was an absolute b*st*rd in my opinion.When he went into that pizza parlor after Clay and started to beat the crap out of him and the other customers trying to stop him...watch the tape of Leno and the "car thief" story...we didn't know then how it really ended but of course he did.How he could sit and joke about how much worse it was getting caught by his dad then the police and never let on what happened...he's truly amazing.

OMG, the car and the pizza story just killed me. How could he joke about it on Leno?

This post has been edited by drycleenonly on Jan 9 2005, 03:32 PM

Rocky's Mom:

I read the book a while ago and will start listening to the tape this week, but I am so disgusted at Faye still from the first reading. I want to see what impression I get by listening. She did go to all that trouble to follow him around all day (and embarrass him, as if that would help anything!), but never went out of her way to stop the abuse. She must have known about the new car incident, and the pizza place beating. Did she just tell him to learn from it, like all the other shit he went through?

I wish he would be interviewed again about the book. I wish someone would ask him about how his mother told him to learn from the bad things in life, even as she herself caused a lot of those bad things!

I personally don't feel she has been a very good mother.Not only did she tolerate abuse and favoritism but she disguised it as religious moral enlightenment,as if it was OK for Clay to suffer because" it would make him a better man".I even think she was abusive herself...all the sentence writing,not letting him go to the dance,and buying him ugly clothes.OK,they couldn't afford (According to her,more on that in a minute) fancy designer clothes and shoes...she worked at Sears,got some kind of employee discount and could probably have afforded something a little more "cool" than what she she did buy him.It seems like she just either didn't care enough or was using it as another "enriching" experience.I don"t get the money issue...Ray had been in the Air Force,possibly long enough for some kind of pension and/or benefits.I'm sure he was paying child support for Jeff and Amy but,according to the book,he worked at Sears,also worked as a prison guard,owned several trailers that he rented ,and had a used car lot.Faye worked at Sears and probably received some child support from Vernon.Clay mentions that Ray collected vintage cars-not a cheap hobby.Amy got a brand new car for her graduation-again,not cheap.Ray bought a brand new Firebird shortly before he passed away-not cheap.But the best they could do for Clay's Christmas presents was the "cheapest,damaged-box shelf from Wal-mart" phone or just batteries?One last thing,what I mentioned earlier about the drive from Raleigh to Charlotte...Clay told Brett that he would drive home from Charlotte to pick him up from a party if he were ever drunk enough to need it..but Faye didn't bother to drive to Charlotte to break the news to Clay about Deb,she just phoned him.

The thing about LTS that is affecting me most at the moment is that I finally read it!

I ordered from Amazon July 7, and it arrived during release-week. But I left it in its box. First, I was turned off by the pre-release snippets and the furious debates that followed (on certain boards). Then, after the book came out, I was turned off by all the adulation of Clay’s saintliness and/or condemnation of his preachiness (book quotes included to support the argument).

I was afraid to read it, for fear it would ruin my JNT concert experience .... then Christmas ... then my whole new year. :hide:

What a whack job I am!! I read it this weekend. It’s pretty good ain’t it? I feel relieved.

It’s good to read a book in ALL its context (not in bits like an expurgated “bible”). <--- aphorism. Yeah, I was a bit slow on the uptake.

When all the bits were leaked, we were always told not to analyze too much because you had to read the whole book for context. I did not find that to be true. The leaked snippets were actually a pretty good intro to the book. There are times when Clay is a bit preachy, but most of the time he is very candid about everything.

I listened to the part about Vernon today. He just seems so closed off, so emotionally paralyzed. When Clay shows him the tape of his performance, he says it was OK but the band was off, and that's it. And Vernon never went to see him with the Hometown Connection, even though other members of his family did. That is just sad. Maybe Vernon was jealous, jealous that his son was a better singer than him, that Clay was young and still had a chance to shine? I get this feeling that Clay has come to some peace about Vernon, though, and really the guy comes off better than Ray! (Not that it takes much.)