Title: Hawk's Army list
Hawk - February 3, 2010 10:52 PM (GMT)
I had a battle two days ago, and I was required to write up a 2k army list. It was my first time really writing a real army list where I could pick and choose (I had just gotten my hands on some new models) but we bumped the point value up to 2500. Here's what I came up with:
-full command, shields
-full command, shields
2 Bolt Throwers
20 Sword Masters
-full command, banner of sorcery
10 Phoenix Guard
1 Lion Chariot
8 Silver Helms
-Full Command, shields
Archmage lvl 4
-Barded Elven Steed
-Jewel of Dusk
-Armour of Heroes
Mage lvl 2
-armour of caledor
I really wanted to fit as many units as I could into a versatile list. I stuck the noble with my Silver Helms, and the two mages hung at the back. Star lance was one of the most amazing items and worked very effectively. Let me know what you guys think, and how I can improve.
strewart - February 4, 2010 01:57 AM (GMT)
The list is illegal.. You can't take magic armour on mages since they can't take mundane armour.
Glad the star lance worked well for you. In general it isn't really much better than a normal lance except it can pop chariots easily and is good against heavy cavalry. If it works, keep it. I'd probably save the 40 points.
Why 20 sword masters? You end up with so many that aren't in contact, it is a waste of points. The idea of SM is to kill like crazy. I think you will get more use out of splitting them to two units of 12 (save points either br dropping the banner of sorcery or the star lance) or you could drop them to 12 and use the points to boost the PG to 18, then give the banner to the PG instead. Generally you want it in a really tough unit anyway, so the PG is a better place.
8 helms is a strange number.. Remember you need 5 across for a rank bonus. I would drop the unit to 5 or 6 and upgrade them to dragon princes, you will find they perform sooo much better for you. Run the unit with the noble 6 across, any excess put at the back to absorb wounds.
ZeltArruin - February 4, 2010 07:57 PM (GMT)
I am very against both magic and bolt throwers, though mostly the latter. My reasoning is this, our combat units are brutal when used well, our combat characters are pretty mediocre, so I only take characters if they will help achieve some goal, like having stubborn phoenix guard, or a bsb granting rerolls to my white lions and said phoenix guard. Even magic defense is not needed, as those points could be better spent on ways to kill or ignore those mages.
Hawk - February 5, 2010 03:11 AM (GMT)
Yeah, looks like I'll have to do some editing. I'm still a little limited to the models I have, that's why the weird numbers. I almost exclusively play dwarves, so maybe I should just ditch magic altogether...
To be honest, I didn't star lance was a very good buy, but it's really nice that there are no armour saves allowed. This gave me the edge in combat with one or two guaranteed kills. I have another battle tomorrow, maybe I'll try 1500 points so I can focus a little more.
zippo! - February 5, 2010 06:23 PM (GMT)
Lion chariot = not worth it. Its almost twice as expensive as a tironic chariot and its slower albiet stronger. Spend the points on two tironic chariots instead, more manouvable and they have long bows, you lose the strengh but its a chariot your gonna get impact hits anyway.
ZeltArruin - February 5, 2010 10:46 PM (GMT)
|QUOTE (zippo! @ Feb 5 2010, 01:23 PM)|
| Lion chariot = not worth it. Its almost twice as expensive as a tironic chariot and its slower albiet stronger. Spend the points on two tironic chariots instead, more manouvable and they have long bows, you lose the strengh but its a chariot your gonna get impact hits anyway. |
Woah man, woah. I love lion chariots, 6 s5 attacks next to impact hits makes for one nasty chariot. I never leave Ulthuan without two in tow. They are capable of breaking a unit on its own. The bows on the tiranoc are not very good, and secondly, beyond the impact hits, the tiranoc can't fight, so if your opponent holds, your doomed.
zippo! - February 5, 2010 11:44 PM (GMT)
I just hate the lion chariot. =D no idea why....The lion chariots strong yes but I just don't like it lol....I prefer tiranoc chariots. faster, but that probably more to do with the style I play my high elves then accual thought.
strewart - February 6, 2010 05:31 AM (GMT)
|QUOTE (ZeltArruin @ Feb 6 2010, 09:16 AM)|
| Woah man, woah. I love lion chariots, 6 s5 attacks next to impact hits makes for one nasty chariot. I never leave Ulthuan without two in tow. They are capable of breaking a unit on its own. The bows on the tiranoc are not very good, and secondly, beyond the impact hits, the tiranoc can't fight, so if your opponent holds, your doomed. |
Seconded. Zippo, have you tried the lion chariot in a few battles? I had exactly the same opinion as you for a long time, but then had spare points and upgraded a tiranoc. Wow. Just wow.
I take one of each for points saving, but the lion chariot always far outperformed the tiranoc. If you fluff the impact hits, that baby still has 6 s5 attacks at high WS. Hell it can sometimes take on full ranked units all by itself on the charge, or at least not flee and hold the unit down for a while. Add to that it causes fear, and given our daemon and VC dominated world getting immunity to those fear checks makes it extremely reliable, or against armies forcing them to take fear is great. Add its US and hitting power to some PG for a combined charge and very little will be able to hold their ground.
zippo! - February 6, 2010 06:26 PM (GMT)
I've used the lion chariot on three occasions. The first on against tomb kings where it got charged to pieces. The second time against the lizard men where a unit of sarus tore it apart and the third time against the druchi were it was destroyed in the first by magic. <_< I know its a good unit just everytime I use it it barely makes up for the points I spend on, which is why I take Tironics instead, somehow they do better....
Look when it comes down to it my lion chariot is the most unlucky unit I have I beleive the best I've rolled for it ever was a 4. I ussually roll my impact hits as 1...Besides that I've seen skaven slaves perform better then my lionchariot. Thats why I never take them, terrible luck on my behalf for it.
The only other high elf player I know has this same luck except he has this problem with his dragon mage. Which is hilarious to watch. I remember the first time I played him, his dragon mage flew down behind me and then miscast causing his mage to die, the dragon who was on the very edge of the board was subject to stupidity for the rest of the game and thanks to his rolling didn't move at all (clap)
strewart - February 6, 2010 07:46 PM (GMT)
Its weird, but everyone seems to have a lucky and an unlucky unit. For me, the tiranoc is unlucky. I always roll really badly for impact hits and it does very little. Tonight, my lion chariot was instrumental in destroying several units and chasing others off the field, it rolled well for impact hits and the crew and lions always perform nicely. The tiranoc never got into combat and failed a fear check to charge thrn got shot up. Use what works for you, if you have tried the lion chariot with no luck then that is all I can ask. I would only have a problem if oyu hadn't actually tried it.
Hawk - February 7, 2010 11:33 PM (GMT)
Yeah, my Silver Helms are generally pretty unlucky, I've gotten overrun by goblins AND dwarves before. Not fun. Lion chariot did brilliantly last battle, I've played with both and Tironics do not work for me one bit. Impact hits and...nothing, it's toast. I had another battle, switched things up just a little bit. I got owned by cannon fire and the dwarf enemy brought an anvil of doom :unsure:, it was not fun. Haha he left his book behind at my place though, and I read through it, found out he cheated pretty hardcore - had two extra special units, used the anvil completely wrong, and I'm still not sure if he knows how to fire cannons. Could someone maybe detail the proper way to fire a cannon, because I'm still a little unsure. Other than that, I won EVERY close combat battle, he just took me out with shooting. Any strategies to take out cannons/warmachines? I've used eagle and charged through untis with star lance before, that's about it.
strewart - February 8, 2010 02:11 AM (GMT)
|QUOTE (Hawk @ Feb 8 2010, 10:03 AM)|
| Yeah, my Silver Helms are generally pretty unlucky, I've gotten overrun by goblins AND dwarves before. |
Its not luck, they are just crap for their points. Think about it; for just 7 points a model extra you get an extra attack, and two attacks each from a lance charge is deadly. Also get the option for magic item on unit champ, magic banner, extra WS, extra Ld I believe, extra movement... Switch those helms for princes, you won't be disappointed.
Look up cannons in the BRB and read it carefully. You guess your range (also remember all guess range weapons must be used at the start of the shooting phase, and all guesses must be made before any measuring is done) then roll the artillery dice, measure to guessed range + art result. That is where the cannon ball lands. You then roll the artillery dice again, and everything between the initial landing spot and the second artillery dice result in a thin straight line is damaged.
ZeltArruin - February 8, 2010 02:22 AM (GMT)
I have had a lion chariot charge and kill 12 orcs before. That is 6 impact hits and 6 hits from the model all wounding.
My unlucky unit it Tyrion. I had him and a unit of dragon princes charge goblins and lose combat, two turns in a row.
The way I handle war machines is two fold, one, ignore them if you are not the dragon, two, destroy them with my dragon. And if they shoot the dragon, then they took my ploy, and my actual units get into combat, where they are safe.